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Okay the best solution to overpopulation of dreads and stations is... |
Enterprise
Chief Marshal
Raven Warriors
Joined: May 19, 2002
Posts: 2576
From: Hawthorne, Nevada
|  Posted: 2010-10-25 10:30
Badges.
Okay, I know this might get heated, but lets keep an open mind.
The fact is, the requirments for badges have been unchanged in the entire 8 years of the game. This wouldn't be a problem, but 8 years ago getting to 1RA took you 2 months playing every day. Gold Star was really hard to get.
But 8 years later the game has evolved alot, and Gold Star is virtually meaningless. You can get it by 1RA, you always could have. But the time frame has gotten much, much shorter. The game has changed but the the badge system has not.
So ships that should be rarer and harder to get are infact, very easy to get now. The problem isn't with rank entirely, its with how badges aren't a challenge. They are like Achievements in a single player game at this point.
What I propose is to seriously up the ante on badge requirements. No adding new badges, no changing badge layouts, just changing at what statistic you get bronze, silver, gold, and platinum.
The only question is, how high?
Well I think its very reasonable that since you can aquire the highest ranked ship in the game at Grand Admiral which is at 81k, I think its reasonable that the statistical value of achieving Gold Star should equal that.
Right now, without losing any prestige, need 1k Combat (3k prestige), 1k planets damaged (1k presige), 1k repair ( 1k prestige) 100 planets captured (500 prestige) 1k construction (1k prestige) 1k jumps (100 prestige) will get you Gold Star. This is about 6600 prestige, just above 1RA. You will have access to 99% of the ship in the game at 1/10th of the prestige for the highest rank for it. What the hell. Disproportionate much?
Simple change. Rounded up, GA is 82k. Make Gold Star equal that, would require a factor of around 12. Since I think thats a little too steep, and there is prestige loss to take into account, I think if we increased all the badge requirement points by a factor of 5. So, 250 for bronze, 2500 for Silver, 5000 for Gold.
This makes for real effort if you want a particular ship, and smaller ships are easier to aquire than larger ones. And it makes flying larger ones worth the effort. Doing that math, upping the factor by 5 would mean you would have Gold star at gaining 33k prestige worth of statistics. More diversity, more challenge to the game, more dynamics because dreads aren't an easy option anymore.
-Ent
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Azure Prower
Chief Marshal
Joined: March 14, 2006
Posts: 309
| Posted: 2010-10-25 10:39
Wrong.
The solution is not to make dreads harder to obtain. It's to make smaller ships appealing.
Missile Frigate and Harrier did that. But then all you heard was QQ from the stubborn dread and station pilots!
[ This Message was edited by: Azure Prower on 2010-10-25 10:40 ]
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Leonide
Grand Admiral
Templar Knights
Joined: October 01, 2005
Posts: 1553
From: Newport News, Virginia
| Posted: 2010-10-25 11:10
i'm sidiing with Enterprise on this one. but the horde of the "gimme now" kids will complain. i miss the days when video games were actually HARD. not the easymode you have in most games now. playing through a couple-hour game without savepoints for example. have to beat it on one playthough. now that is hard. we need to bring that back, so i side with Enterprise. badge requierments are needed to be looked at.
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Thernhoghas
Grand Admiral
Exathra Alliance Fleet
Joined: September 18, 2010
Posts: 243
From: somewhere in Germany
| Posted: 2010-10-25 11:18
Well tbh I need to side with both opinions here.
The badge requirements really should be overlooked. I'm playing this game a month now and apart from the transporter badges I didn't have to put any effort in the badges. BUT that wouldn't be enough. It is also necessary to make small ships more attractive. Alone neither of these suggestions would solve the problem. hey need to be combined
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Piotr-san
Chief Marshal
*Renegade Space Marines*
Joined: July 18, 2002
Posts: 385
From: Poland
| Posted: 2010-10-25 12:31
EvE has a solution for this problem, tech 2 ships. Advance versions of smaller ships that would require higher rank and badges e.g. Marshal and CM and Platinum badges but gain some additional slots for weapons , armor or engines. Thats a good way to make the battlefield more differs.
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Azure Prower
Chief Marshal
Joined: March 14, 2006
Posts: 309
| Posted: 2010-10-25 13:15
Quote:
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On 2010-10-25 11:10, Leonide wrote:
i'm sidiing with Enterprise on this one. but the horde of the "gimme now" kids will complain. i miss the days when video games were actually HARD. not the easymode you have in most games now. playing through a couple-hour game without savepoints for example. have to beat it on one playthough. now that is hard. we need to bring that back, so i side with Enterprise. badge requierments are needed to be looked at.
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So in other words, making it longer for newer people to obtain the same fire power as you so you can blast away their inferior ships with your mighty dread/station. All because you played the game longer? You sure you just don't want to make the game easier for yourself?
Time spent != difficulty.
No matter how long it takes, it still the same difficulty.
[ This Message was edited by: Azure Prower on 2010-10-25 13:20 ]
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Iwancoppa
Fleet Admiral
Joined: November 15, 2008
Posts: 709
| Posted: 2010-10-25 14:13
Quote:
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On 2010-10-25 10:39, Azure Prower wrote:
Wrong.
The solution is not to make dreads harder to obtain. It's to make smaller ships appealing.
Missile Frigate and Harrier did that. But then all you heard was QQ from the stubborn dread and station pilots!
[ This Message was edited by: Azure Prower on 2010-10-25 10:40 ]
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This man has the plan.
honestly, just make small ships have more appeal.
you know, im seeing it on icc. where more often going to pull a destroyer/cruiser then a dred or station, simply because we know they are great ships witch are a barrel of laughs at times.
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Iwancoppa
Fleet Admiral
Joined: November 15, 2008
Posts: 709
| Posted: 2010-10-25 14:15
Quote:
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On 2010-10-25 14:13, lulzypulzy*STEAK!!* wrote:
Quote:
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On 2010-10-25 10:39, Azure Prower wrote:
Wrong.
The solution is not to make dreads harder to obtain. It's to make smaller ships appealing.
Missile Frigate and Harrier did that. But then all you heard was QQ from the stubborn dread and station pilots!
[ This Message was edited by: Azure Prower on 2010-10-25 10:40 ]
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This man has the plan.
honestly, just make small ships have more appeal.
you know, im seeing it on icc. where more often going to pull a destroyer/cruiser then a dred or station, simply because we know they are great ships witch are a barrel of laughs at times.
Honestly, there is no point in making big ships harder to get if people actualy WANT to pull a small one out anyway.
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Tommas [ USF HunnyBunny ]
Chief Marshal
Pitch Black
Joined: February 04, 2006
Posts: 581
From: Norway
| Posted: 2010-10-25 15:26
@Azure Prower: Thats cinda the point by ranking up, to get meaner ships. duh!
Anyways i have to agree with ent on this, prestige gaining is insane atm. They lowered it but not enough in my mind. Played the other day and got about 1k pres in so short amount of time...bleh
Anyways. Ent is saying multiply with 5..i think thats low, mainly because i think pres gain have more then 5 times it once was, and this is because of easier access to hull damage. Before it was a harder to get to someones hull, mainly because the ships where faster, more agile then it is now. Now days everyone running around in dreads and station = slow combat and numbers.
And this is also seen in the ranking list of ship damage. ppl got insane amount of it. So to have an gold badge when having 5k ship damage is low.
I also think they need to make the smaller ships better, i think that everyone agrees that a cruiser vs cruiser fight is a heck lot more fun then dread vs dread fight.
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Iwancoppa
Fleet Admiral
Joined: November 15, 2008
Posts: 709
| Posted: 2010-10-25 15:44
idea. no stations or dreds unless 5 people on each faction. fixed.
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ADmiraLMaXimus (Bringer of Doom)
Chief Marshal
Praetorian Wolves
Joined: March 09, 2002
Posts: 363
From: Earth
| Posted: 2010-10-25 16:01
When I started playing over 8 years ago there werent too many dreads and stations arround.
However the Majority of players and I mean almost all of them played in the scenario server.
Now most of the players are in the MV and they have to deal with bigger ships there all the time.
So now that there are so many more ways to die then the solution was to make it easier for the current new players to attain greater ships.
But by making it easier in case of the time it takes due to the amount of points and press gained, you have now made less experienced players capable of piloting the better ships and yet 90% of said players dont know how to properly pilot any one ship, really.
How can they .... they got to that ship in 1 week from just learning how to play to piloting a dread and wondering why they still get killed so fast.
The vet players... you can tell who they are.... they know how to pilot anything in the game, Even a UGTO vet pilot can give an ICC pilot or kluth pilot advice and likewise to any player. But giving a kid the keys to a car and saying drive.... is a big difference from giving them to an adult.
lets just admit a mistake was made and move on.....
I agree with both LEO and Ent in that we need more appealing small ships and a rework of the badge system.
I dont mind flying with new players but if they are incapable of piloting their craft they put my ship at risk
Lets Make A Change 
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Botji
Fleet Admiral
Joined: June 27, 2010
Posts: 17
| Posted: 2010-10-25 16:49
Personally i think it its just 2 areas that need changes to make Darkspace much more balanced both between ships and races.
1. Nerf repair rate a bit and make depos on planet turn off when planet is under blockade OR make it so ships cant get repaired for x seconds after taking damage so you cant be fully repaired while the whole ship is exploding at the same time.
2. Dreads and stations drop all or almost all their lasers, without them smaller ships and missiles are effective against them. Preferably the core weapons would also lose some speed so they wont be as good against smaller ships.
ICC has 1 dedicated destroyer full of lasers just for missile/scout def and UGTO has both a frigate and a destroyer for the same purpose, perhaps time to put them to use?
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*FTL*Soulless
Marshal
Joined: June 25, 2010
Posts: 787
From: Dres-Kona
| Posted: 2010-10-25 16:49
Quote:
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On 2010-10-25 15:44, lulzypulzy*STEAK!!* wrote:
idea. no stations or dreds unless 5 people on each faction. fixed.
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The UGTO always wins......
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OneBoredSith
Grand Admiral
Joined: August 18, 2010
Posts: 17
From: United Kingdom
| Posted: 2010-10-25 17:31
Perhaps restriction the max amount of dreads/ stations allowed in MV on each 7 servers i.e. only a maxium of 4 dreads /2 stations are allowed in Sagittarius server for each faction.
Or add an ingame kill count for ship requisition i.e. like in Modern Warfare 2, u get to use Support Powers from 3 consecutive kill (UAV) to 25 consecutive kill (Nuke)(kill count resets if killed, SD, planet collision or anything that involves ur ship blowing up).
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SpaceAdmiral
Grand Admiral
Joined: May 05, 2010
Posts: 1005
| Posted: 2010-10-25 18:05
i will make a list of proposed solutions and their problems
Stations only usable if X many people are on that faction
-so the more populated faction always wins?
Limit or hardcap number of stations
-extremely unpopular, will result in alot of rage quitting and i don't think the playerbase can take another hit after the res implement was implemented before compensations (people quit before faster mining and more res cargo, and never logged back in to find these compensations). Also it will result in sy camping and staying afk wars.
"SOME ONE LOG OFF" "NO U" "hey that guy is afk in station" "yeah he didnt want to lose his spot -.-" "/y hey guys theres an afk station at X planet, can u kill him?" "no, our dreads and stations are afk too" "use small ships?" "nah, 99% of our faction is sy camping, one of those big ships will log out eventually if their comp goes into sleep mode"
Ramping up the ranks
-will render many peoples' garages half or 3/4 useless, only delays problem until everyone has that rank, again. And if we keep delaying ranks like that eventually it will be way too hard for new players to catch up
ramping up the badges
-mostly same as above, and many badges are harder to get than you think, bombing is so slow i made 20 bombing pres for nuking a planet, and few people have 500 caps. will discourage many new players. Also so we have to jump 5000 times to fly a ship?
making small ships more effective
-hard to implement with balance check, but if it is balanced this is a great solution
T2 ships
-again balance but otherwise good
find any other solutions and i will try to see any problems, some might not have many or any at all like making smaller ships more attractive.
also if we have a good enough future fighter interface we will need pd ships
for the topic: you assume no res loss, but how many time have you been killed in a support craft? At least 1/4 at the very least is from getting killed in a support ship, and they lose very little so I'd say at the very least that's alot.
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