| Author |
Fast scouts untouchable? |
Wild Cat
Fleet Admiral
Joined: August 28, 2004
Posts: 109
From: The Netherlands
|  Posted: 2010-09-01 07:11
Fast scouts untouchable?
Less than a week ago, I had an encounter with an ICC player who improved his scout with mostly speed enhancements. I don’t know what the top speed was, but it was extremely fast. If it wasn’t for the different engine trail color I would swear it was a missile.
At the time I was flying a frigate (defense/support type) loaded with beams and ECCM devices. Intercepting missiles and I’ve to say, with the new improved PD, those beam frigates work better then the destroyer picket.
The scout attacked me and I returned fire. Usually after multiple volleys of beams fired at a scouts, they turn and run, for I usually cut through their shields and eventually start hitting their inner armor ring if the stay to close.
To my surprise, this wasn’t the case with this very speedy scout. I was expecting the scout to not last all that long before jumping out or blowing up. But to my surprise, my ship blew up.
Now I wasn’t fully sure if this was due to the scout or missiles aimed at me, for there was a crazy amount of missiles passing me.
I returned and encountered the scout again, this time I turned PD of and focused fully on the scout
Normally I wear them down, but instead he was gradually wearing me down even as I managed to maintained a continues beam barrage on him, I hardly saw his shield drop and I noticed that I wasn’t hitting the scout but all my beams where hitting right behind it. I got killed again, but during the battle I started taking on missile fire from a nearby planet and maybe from some players.
I ran in to him a 3rd time and after trading some fire I jumped out, for again I wasn’t breaking through his shields and my armor was steady on degrading, wasn’t planning on getting killed again.
That I got owned by a scout when I’m flying a frigate I can live with, after all he was enhanced with expensive trinkets. The thing that is troubling me the most is that it really felt like I wasn’t hitting him at all and that with beam weapons that don’t miss. When I took notice of his shields, they had take some damage, but pretty much stay there, even after several beam volleys. I don’t believe the shield of an ICC scout is able to regenerate at such a rate it can keep up with the damage of 4 up to 6 beams hitting.
Has anyone experienced something similar, for currently it doesn’t make sense to me and it is annoying me quite a lot!
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Wild Cat
Dutch Time
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The Fridge
Chief Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: December 13, 2008
Posts: 559
From: In Your Fridge, Eating your Foods.
| Posted: 2010-09-01 07:49
How close was the scout to you when you were lasering
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Maroc
Marshal
*Renegade Space Marines*
Joined: August 14, 2008
Posts: 31
From: Lithuania
| Posted: 2010-09-01 08:28
I know what u mean. I been in familiar situation. For example : Im in EAD or BS shoot at ICC cruiser who is flying at full speed. I see QSTs hitting ICC ship but it doesnt get any damage or he is damaged but just a little compared to normal hit. Such situation anoys me but i dont think about it much. Usualy this situation happens when my target is turned his left, right or back side at me. So i think sometimes when u hit a target and that target is flying fast inuf and at certain distance from u the ship is able to make a distance from the blast inuf to receave less damage or even escape from it. Well atleast it looked like this. Its usualy hapens for me when i fight destroyer and cruiser class ships.
But if that scout was able to escape from lasers than its something weard because lasers always makes a direct hit. It makes sence when it happens with projectiles but when with lasers....
[ This Message was edited by: Maroc on 2010-09-01 08:32 ]
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BackSlash
Marshal
Galactic Navy
Joined: March 23, 2003
Posts: 11183
From: Bristol, England
| Posted: 2010-09-01 08:36
Sometimes you'll see yourself hitting the target, but due to your latency they might have dodged at the last second, meaning no damage was dealt.
Beams also deal no damage if the target goes outside of the beams max range.
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Glaceon
Fleet Admiral
Joined: January 08, 2010
Posts: 141
| Posted: 2010-09-01 08:43
rofl i feel ur pain icc stealth vet finaly pinged & alphaed with my siph only to just move quickly enough and get almost no damage....
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Wapan
Grand Admiral
Joined: September 28, 2009
Posts: 12
From: Wapan
| Posted: 2010-09-01 08:58
ok, I'm not trying to take the credit for it, and correct me if I'm wrong but it might have been me flying the scout. I know that I fought you a couple of times last week (I think 3 encounters), I know that you were in a defense frigate, and I definitely was in a highly modified icc scout. I have been flying scouts religiously lately because I like the fast action of flying between weapon shoots and being able to easily get behind other ships. Either way, whether it was me or not, I have some insight.
I do know that the icc scouts have had their current shield regeneration since they were updated more than 6 months ago when I started flying them. There are 2 major ship design factors I use when flying:
1) In my experience, because scouts (and definitely a modified one) have such a higher rate of thrust and max speed, it is generally easy to get behind anything larger than scouts. If I'm fighting a ugto scout, I use my turning rate advantage to be able to get behind them. In general it's not hard to out maneuver most other ships. Once I get behind a target I don't leave until I have very little hull left or (being icc) I run out of ammo.
2) Rotating of shields comes in extremely handy in a scout that doesn't have alot of protection (also we don't have any armour, just shields). So while you're firing on my front arc, my left right and aft arcs are regenerating allowing me to move shields to my forward arc. Once the battle is over I switch to Defense Mode and quickly regen my shields back up to 100% in no time. With defense mode a scout with absolutely no shields can reasonably get back up to full shields within a minute.
It is possible to to destroy a scout, it just takes more than a defense frigate (Like a station with one alpha or two assault scouts or combination of ships working together and not allowing me to sit behind one of them and just hull them). In my experience I would have to say that I love fighting a defense frigate because they are easy targets for me (engies and suppies being the only easier ones). The ability for a defense frigate to hit me with more fire power then what I'm dishing out just doesn't happen especially when I'm behind you. Add that to my ability to rotate shields and you just can't go it alone against certain scouts in a frigate.
 Also a tidbit of interesting information my modified scout gets 45.5 gus/sec, assuming you were talking about me lol
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Wild Cat
Fleet Admiral
Joined: August 28, 2004
Posts: 109
From: The Netherlands
| Posted: 2010-09-01 09:35
I don't recall who I was facing, but I do recall multiple passes where the scout flew over/under me to land a volley of torpedo's. During a series of sharp turns
I'm aware that ones a target leaves max beam range no damage is done, but plenty of times the scout flew out of range did a 180° turn and came straight back at me for an other pass, flying passed me again well with in beam range.
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Wild Cat
Dutch Time
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Bardiche
Chief Marshal
Joined: November 16, 2006
Posts: 1247
| Posted: 2010-09-01 10:54
I once fought redbandit's speed-modded Battle Cruiser in a Heavy Cruiser. Due to defence mode, it was mostly a stand-still, but eventually I ran out of energy.
Speed-modded ships are incredibly good and I don't understand why not everyone realises this! Maybe there's a problem with damage calculation if the enemy ship moves too fast?
For Scouts, I think that it's OK if they're incredibly hard to kill with full-speed mods. It just means someone found the optimal way to mod them, and you can still end them by SDing on them or chasing with a Scout of your own (with some speed mod).
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Enterprise
Chief Marshal
Raven Warriors
Joined: May 19, 2002
Posts: 2576
From: Hawthorne, Nevada
| Posted: 2010-09-01 11:06
Quote:
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On 2010-09-01 10:54, Bardiche wrote:
Speed-modded ships are incredibly good and I don't understand why not everyone realises this! Maybe there's a problem with damage calculation if the enemy ship moves too fast?
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Probably because you eat up more energy trying to utilize it. I prefer +defense because I get similar benefits without having to sacrifice energy.
-Ent
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Talien
Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: May 11, 2010
Posts: 2044
From: Michigan
| Posted: 2010-09-01 12:24
Beam damage is spread out over the duration of the firing animation and not done all at once like projectiles, for a ship going 40+ speed flying head on to another ship it takes about 2 seconds to go from max beam range on one side of the ship to max beam range on the other side, meaning you barely take any damage from beams.
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Rebellion
Marshal
Faster than Light
Joined: June 20, 2009
Posts: 730
From: sol
| Posted: 2010-09-01 14:51
i love my super speed scout!
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| Dark Hiigaran |
Chief Marshal
Joined: July 07, 2007
Posts: 426
From: Slovenia (Europe)
| Posted: 2010-09-01 14:57
I have a scout that goes over 40 on ICC ...
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Schroedingers Gun
Fleet Admiral
Joined: April 24, 2010
Posts: 99
From: favour6
| Posted: 2010-09-01 15:19
ICC can do a 51.8 speed scout
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Lithium
Chief Marshal
Joined: June 29, 2003
Posts: 109
| Posted: 2010-09-01 17:09
Frigates need some buff.
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Talien
Marshal
Templar Knights
Joined: May 11, 2010
Posts: 2044
From: Michigan
| Posted: 2010-09-01 18:58
Frigates are fine, people just need to learn how to use them properly. Way too many people try one a few times and die because they're doing it wrong then complain that Frigates suck.
Frigates in general are support combatants, they don't have the speed or maneuverability that lets Scouts dodge pretty much anything thrown at them, and alone they don't have the firepower to chew up anything larger than a Destroyer in short order unless used either in wolfpacks (as demonstrated by ICC's extensive use of Missile Frigates) or combined with a larger ship. What most Frigates do have is very good energy management and good standoff capability, or in the case of most Kluth Frigates, stupidly easy gameplay with cloak combined with their small size.
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